Daisycutter’s club

I’m firmly mid-table in Season 2 of PES2017, on Professional difficulty. After a brief rally that saw me nuzzling the outer edges of the top 6, I’m now 12 points off the top 6 with 10 matches left. That’s probably not enough time to haul myself into promotion contention. Even the most generous ML league table script would struggle to look away whistling while I hauled myself up from here:

pes2017-season-2-after-36

I would pretend to be all ashamed and embarrassed about being mired in Division 2 on Professional – but pretending is all it’d be. I’m having much too good a time to be bovvered, really, about not measuring up to some notional yardstick of performance that I don’t subscribe to anyway.

Master League players do not compete with each other. I also don’t think they play to ‘beat the game’. They’re in it for the self-contained experience – for the journey, if I may say so. Nobody walks the road with you. The whole point of walking this road is that there’s nobody else there to spoil the fun. It’s just something for you, and you alone, and that is its glory.

It’s time to talk about long-rangers in PES2017 – or their absence, by and large.

Since day 1 of PES2017, I have scored two goals that could be classed as long-rangers. There was this one by Hettich, which earned him the accolade of My Favourite Player, until I sold him not long after.

I don’t regard that goal as a true long-ranger, on account of its placement in the net. The kind of long-ranger I am talking about is struck from 30-40 yards and rockets into the postage stamp corner of the net, preferably cannoning off the underside of the bar or the side of the post. Or even, in the best cases, the underside of the bar and the side of the post. Netting a thundering, blasting shot from decent range is one of the principal joys of Pro Evo, and of life.

So far, I have yet to score one of these in PES2017.

This isn’t a moan. I’m not paranoid that there are no long-range goals in PES2017. I have seen examples. (So please don’t post any stray videos you’ve come across in forums. I’ve probably seen them already. Although I am interested in your own.)

The forums opine, based on scanty evidence as usual, that long-range shooting is reserved for the top-rated players. This makes no sense given the abundance of long-range goals throughout the lower divisions of ‘real life’, but it is just the kind of thing that PES Productions are capable of doing.

Long-range goals were too common in PES2016. I thought the balance was just right in PES2015 (the most underrated PES game since PES2009, or even arguably since PES4).

Maybe the keepers are the key in PES2017. They’re the best PES keepers we have ever seen, of that there’s no doubt.

Here’s the other quasi-long-ranger I mentioned. I scored this just yesterday. It’s an interesting one, as it’s a bit of a daisycutter that appears to fool an unsighted keeper from a diagonal distance of 25+ yards:

 

Updated: 21st October 2016 — 11:11

101 Comments

  1. James – wonderful long-rangers! I’m going to be pinging them in now, I’m sure… My reluctance to get any player recommended here or on the forums isn’t a strict policy. I will never go and consciously seek them out (it’s just not happening), but if in the course of a future search the stars fall aright, I’m not averse to picking up a player whose name I’ve seen mentioned around. ‘So what’s the difference?’ you might ask. A world of difference, I’d reply. My ML has to be just mine in that way, it’s not something I will change.

    Darryl – I doubt very much that long-range shooting has been reserved for players holding the LRD skill. If you try an LRD next time you get the chance (R2+shoot) you’ll see it’s quite weak and nothing at all like its name. For me ‘Long Range Drive’ conjures up images of Bobby Charlton-style, ruler-straight howitzers. The LRD skill is nothing like that, and in execution is as floaty and slow-moving a shot as you’d expect.

  2. James – I’m finding that big players are the most effective option full stop. Such is the small difference of speed, explosive power, skill, etc on the pitch that having a height advantage is a major bonus. They really did nerf the Michael Owen factor too heavily, far too often a 90 striker is not able to skin a 70 defender so crosses to peter crouch or any of my tall midfielders at corners is my main goal getter.

  3. James – those Wallace goals are beautiful. Great find!

  4. Wallace goal is excellent, without R2 fills me with hope. First time running onto the ball seems the way to go. I’ve had one similar, but the keeper was equal to it, Peter.

    Totti is probably my one player whose individualality stands out. Slow and lumbering on the ball, but bags of skill. Will try a rabona at any given opportunity.

  5. Season 3 over and have finished 3rd. One thing I have noticed is that I rarely get pegged back once I am leading a game and seem to find shutting out games easier than in previous editions. I have my eye out for an expected difficulty spike next season.

  6. The R2 modifier usually seems to reproduce the old PES “Del Piero” goal – an undocumented ball-curling skill that only a handful of players (including a young Rooney) could perform. Not sure if any of you remember it, but it only tended to work from a very specific sweet spot near either corner of the box.

    I’m curious to see what might happen with a R2+shoot hit with a pass moving directly towards a player, which usually confers greater momentum on the strike. It could lead to a Roberto Carlos/Matt Le Tissier type of goal, with ridiculous curl and speed. Maybe this is the true LRD skill?

    Also, has anyone tried to combine the R2 and Knuckle Shot modifiers while shooting from range? Do they stack?

  7. I think knuckle shot is only for free kicks, no?

    Just won five out of my last six btw. Still 3 points off sixth place in the championship. Very enjoyable games overall. One nasty one with horribly scripted, fake goals in them (2 for the CPU, one for me) but overall very good. Castledine in this restarted arsenal ML is turning into something special! Way better than his iteration in my precious ajax ML. So I can confirm that there can be strong variance in player growth between MLs.

  8. Uh, that should have been “previous”, not “precious” as it was anything but that.

  9. My ml journey is over. Mid table championship season three but the killer is 4 goals in 8 games. It is an utterly joyless experience. Basically if I don’t score with a cross and header I don’t score. I’d be interested to know what is happening to other superstar players but I’m finding that even with very good players I can’t score long rangers, I can’t accelerate past defenders, I lose every 50/50 with almost no fouls ever being awarded (NG levels of irritation) and the tactics simply don’t change anything at all. It’s very similar to how I found my patched 2014 career till I dropped to top player. I don’t know whether I’m not as good as I once were, I don’t think so as I stopped both 2015 and 16 early as the scoring was silly but I don’t see how this can change when I have premier league players already and I’m mixing it up as much as I can. My team spirit is 91 – no difference, superstar is just a slog.

    I think I’ll take a deep breath and start up a new career on top player as I seem to be a loan voice of frustration at the way the game is going. I actually liked the first season of defeat after defeat but now it’s just boring.

  10. Uncle Turf – I found the Championship to be packed with teams that play the worst style of PES 2017 football on Superstar. Hyper-defensive when out of possession, slow and methodical when attacking with no more than three or four players (which makes them much harder to tackle, and quick to park the bus when you do), and absolutely brutal in their challenges once they adopt late-game tactics to close out the match or press for goals.

    I scraped through the playoffs after finishing sixth. In my second season, with almost exactly the same squad, I’ve just won the PL by seven clear points. I’m concerned that it’s a little too easy, but the variety of different AI approaches that you encounter makes it much more enjoyable. I had to work for almost every win.

    I’m using a 4-3-3 formation with an asymmetrical midfield three – a deep, central DMF, a shuttle-running CMF moved slightly to the right of the upper part of the centre circle, and an AMF even further forward and slightly off to the left – he’s a few pixels from the automatic transition to the SS role. In my experience, this gives incredible variety in passing angles.

    Attacking tactics are: possession game, short-pass, centre, maintain formation.
    Defensive tactics are: frontline pressure, middle and aggressive.

    I’ve stopped using Advanced Instructions. I can see the difference they might make, but I don’t need them (or the pretty steep stamina loss penalties).

    I hit the Superstar wall in the first week after release, and then again when I started this new ML with Wolves. The turning point for me was when I started to slow things right down, and regularly “go home” and pass it back to defenders if I couldn’t see an opening. If a player has space but there’s no obvious pass, I’ll stop and draw in a couple of defenders before making a simple square or backwards ball. Once I’ve clicked into this slower and more methodical rhythm, I start to notice runs and openings that just weren’t there before.

    I now get less than a third of my goals through crosses – perhaps even a quarter.

    I’m not sure that I’ll play through a Championship season again. It’s more of a grind than a challenge. If you’re looking to start a new ML career but stick with Superstar, I’d recommend picking a relegation candidate in the Premier League. It’s so much more fun in the top division.

  11. Well Valerón’s on his way. Couldn’t get him to sign a new contract and eventually he put talks on hold and left on a free. Shame, he looks like he could be one of the best regen mids in the game. Scrambling to find cover now. Top by a solitary point.

    Edit: A certain Mr. Castleside rejoins the Norfolk Boys on a six-month loan deal.

  12. Uncle Turf – don’t lose faith! I finished 22nd in my first season on SS in the championship. I got my TS up to the low 70s but my team (the original defaults) were turd and I lost some to retirement and others who eere too old to be useful. I rebuilt my squad that window but dropped down to 32 TS. In my first 15 games of season 2 I didn’t win once. I drew 6 and lost 9. I was second from bottom. By the end of the season and with my team gelling well I won 15, drew 8 and lost 7, to finish 16th.

    I’m now 25 games into season 3, TS between high 80s and low 90s and 2 points clear at the top, having lost 3.

    I echo James’ words on the style of the AI in the Championship – but it is the hardest league in the world after all 😉

  13. Thanks guys. I don’t mind grind, I’ve done plenty of that over the years it was the lack of any noticeable improvement in game quality that was getting me, huge team spirit, top quality for the division in lamela, origi and depay, yet same old rough house football. No long Rangers, no penalties, not even burning wall of fire!

    I have started again and I’ve applied that live update that I didn’t use. There are a huge amount of free agents suddenly available that I never saw. I obviously can’t afford more than a couple but I’m going to slightly vary the formation and hang on to some defaults a little longer just buying top quality options. I think I will stick on superstar and hope the refined approach might offer something different ie. When Peter crouch becomes available I won’t be going for him. I would have been really struggling to add a player to that favourite list as I had so little love for any. Weird how it all fell apart so quickly as I really liked season one. Ridiculously I was offered the England job at the end of season two.

  14. Yeah, that’s the one element I don’t like about ML or FIFA’s Career Mode – the ease, and for me the distraction, of getting an international posting. I’d NEVER sim a game on ML for my club, but I always som the international friendlies if I stupidly take an international posting because I don’t see the point of them. Even the qualifiers disrupting my club flow irritates me! I was offered Spain, France and Germany at end of season 1 (?!) and England at end of season 2. I’ve taken the England job, but don’t really have any enthusiasm for it.

    I’m working 2 weeks of 9-5s in central London starting tomorrow so PES time is at a premium.

    On a side note, when I was writing an article on run up to Rio 2014, I stumbled across the fact that the majority of goals scored at international level are from crosses into the box, so it’s not unusual if there’s a high amount of goals from crosses. I’ll pump balls into the box but it certainly isn’t a guaranteed goal.

  15. James – some very good points there, you’re like the Dr Brian Cox of Pro Evo. I’ve been mulling over a – for me – unthinkable move: ditching my favoured 4-2-2-2 which has served me well for 6 Pro Evos now. I’ve been thinking about how PES2017 plays and how I want to play and I am contemplating an Uncle Turf-style back 3 with wingbacks in a 3-5-2. I’ve tried 4-3-3 many times and never got anywhere. Fullbacks play so aggressively in PES anyway that they might as well formalise the arrangement and be official wingbacks.

    Where I am at the moment is indicated by the fact that I’m about to finish lower-table in Season 2 in the Championship on Professional difficulty – with a TS of 80-85.

    Tommy – good old Castleside will not let you down. The best black Norwegian DMF in Pro Evo history.

  16. I may have made a mistake with contract renewals, £3 million down on my massive wage budget and down to 16 players. I now need to offload some good players. I’m still cruising though. Treble is the aim this year after the double last season but my contract renewals will require a rejig mid season potentially causing issues with my objectives. A few loans are required to fill the squad.

    My England career is tougher, world cup this summer and still trying to build team spirit before then. England have some decent players but nothing compared to the team I’ve built at club level.

  17. As predicted the new season came with a difficulty spike as the CPU is giving me even less space. Mixed bag of results as I drew the first three, then won 7-0 in the cup against Huddersfield, lost 3-0 in my CL opener before finishing with two scrappy away wins to take me to ninth.

  18. NG – that’s what bothers me partly, that I have a formation that did OK in season two yet seems to have been completely nullified in season three. Swapping things around, trying different players, initiating advanced tactics, none of it seems to alter the flow of games. One thing you don’t need worry about is the attack down the side and cross. Three at the back would have killed you in years gone by but I find very few headers or shots across goal into the far corner, most AI efforts are rather quite scruffy. I’ve started my new ml with a very serious free agent keeper, amazed he was available.

  19. 433 works miles better in terms of enjoyment. I experimented with it in my previous ajax save and have now carried it over into my current arsenal saves. It opens up way more passing lanes and midfielders usually cover well for the aggressive fullback. You get caught on the break more often but since keepers are so good this year that’s hardly ever a problem for me – in the championship that is. Can’t comment on premiership just yet but the way things are looking now I’ll at least be playing in the playoffs at the end of this first season.

  20. Jay – I’m with you on the international management thing, to the point that I’ve never accepted a post. In my management narrative I shouldn’t be a club and international manager at the same time. I would however consider a career where once I’ve had significant trophy success I had to give up club in order to manage country.

  21. #1 – 4-3-3 was my formation for many many years, from the late ISS games all the way to PES2011 or so, when it abruptly stopped working for me. It still doesn’t in PES2017. My formation experiment might happen in time for tomorrow’s post.

    Uncle Turf – after years of scoffing at the whole back 3 notion I have to admit Chelsea in so-called ‘real life’ (in the inferior version of the game that’s represented in PES), seemed to do well enough with them yesterday. If you’re a formation nerd I recommend the Jonathan Wilson tactics book that most people seem to have read the first 30 pages of. Inverting the Pyramid. Fascinating stuff about the football’s early years and its routine 2-3-5 formations etc.

    Darryl – you in the CL while I’m scrapping in the Championship! And you’re on TP… Strange times.

    Cook/Jay – I can’t accept an International job for the reasons you both mention. International breaks are just not tolerable when immersed in the domestic action.

  22. NG – curious how that turns out. I’ve always been a 442 man myself but for my playstyle at least, 443 opens up the game more in this edition.

  23. 7-0 is just not conceivable in my experience to date. It’s the same old 16 shots, 1 goal at best when I’m on top. That’s why I’m happy to have a complete restart rather than tinkering, every signing will be considered fully, every game approached according to the opposition. I may even retain two full backs in case I need to drop them deeper. The only position I find useless is the rwf/lwf, they drop alarmingly when asked to play a little deeper/more central.

    NG – got that book, think I made it to page 50. Currently reading the routledge handbook of football studies as I’m slowly transforming into a student of sociology. Cue more years of unemployment…

  24. Five games into my new ml and I’ve actually won a game. I’ve only scored one goal but my defending is much better and I’ve adopted a new 3-1-3-3 sort of formation. Still don’t see any change whatsoever with the advanced tactics,no difference between centring, hug, false, etc. I also got a penalty! Which hit the sodding post. Down to 16 players as the budget was laughable. A year of grind ahead.

  25. Uncle Turf – I’m also a tactics sceptic when it comes to football games, but some of the preset tactics in PES2017 definitely do work. It’s a matter of picking them. False 9 works. The defensive one that leaves a nominated player upfield even when you’re on all-out defence also works. ATT/DEF levels affect some of them. e.g. Attacking Fullbacks which only really works if you’re on Level 3-5. That big fan-favourite, though, Hug the Touchline, I don’t think does work, or not enough to be noticeable, which amounts to the same thing.

  26. It would be tricky for me to test any full back tactic so accept that might work but Ihave t seen false nine do anything, I don’t know whether my formation simply baffles the AI as its always a custom job where there is no central striker. Can I just confirm the settings needed – they are all on automatically and you don’t need to alter anything in the settings menu, simply button activate once you’ve allocate a tactic to a direction? I don’t quite understand why konami set them all to be on.

  27. NG – strange times indeed and I don’t at any point feel like I am getting on top of the game. Some of the old tactics do fascinste me. I am having some success with the Ajax inspired 3-4-3. In past editions this would have seen me torn apart.

  28. Darryl – I think the much improved keepers have something to do with that. I’ve seen many a medium range or even close range shot and cringed as I was sure they would go in, only to see the keeper make a save.

  29. Inverting The Pyramid is excellent. I’ve read it twice. I know PESUniverse used it on their classics option file. It’s a godsend to read about managers like Herrera, Rappan and especially Bela Guttman in the absence of any English language biographies of them. After reading it I play a 235 formation on PES. I think it was either PES2010 or the magic boots one. I found it worked quite well. Wouldn’t try it on this until my CBS were in the 80s with speed over 80 and an incredible DMC. I think I played CB CB DMC CM CM RWF SS CF SS LWF.

    I’m in the January window of season 3, top of league but accidentally sold my back up CB, who I’ll be attempting to buy back in the summer. )3/ nothing h special so should be possible, but he’s one of my originals so I want him back!

    Contracts were a real headache. Some just won’t sign after many renegotiations. I’ll have to sell at this rate. Luckily they aren’t in my first choice but is my back up keeper and first reserve CB, so will need to be replaced.

  30. Small but potentially significant detail that I forgot to mention: I play *every* match with the attack-defence level set to one notch above default (orange bar). First thing I do in every game is to double-tap up on the D-pad. Without this, I just don’t get the support in attack, or the same variety of runs.

    As I see it, conservative use of the attack-defence gauge (default green or, worse, light blue bar) is a false economy if you’re the type of player who likes to boss possession and probe for openings. If your team doesn’t push up to support your attacks, you’re likely to suffer more regular transitions when your players become isolated without an obvious out-ball.

    I can deal with being a little short-handed in defence at times, and I’m prepared to accept the consequences when I can’t, because I know that I’ll concede more goals if my attacking moves are breaking down because players aren’t getting the support they need.

    I strongly recommend a 4-3-3, though: you almost always have a passing lane to a full-back or winger, which is invaluable. Three at the back seems like overkill, unless you’ve got a defender who can regularly step into midfield (which might be an interesting experiment at some point). I really think that my success has been due to the fact that I commit so many players forward.

    In other news: Walace is still pretty good at long shots.

    Still experimenting with long shots. I don't have a deadball specialist in my ML squad… but don't really need one when Walace can do this. pic.twitter.com/xb1pVfcSCn— James Price (@_GamesPrice_) 24 October 2016

    The replay better illustrates the ridiculous curve of the shot. pic.twitter.com/pSBy0LFzMs— James Price (@_GamesPrice_) 24 October 2016

    I'm impressed by the sheer variety of long shots in PES 2017 this year – no two efforts are quite the same. pic.twitter.com/kb6HxbzEdP— James Price (@_GamesPrice_) 24 October 2016

    Let's see that one again! 😉 pic.twitter.com/DK37Ad7dbn— James Price (@_GamesPrice_) 24 October 2016

    Long shots in PES 2017 are so good, with the right player and feel for the timing, that even the near misses feel like triumphs. pic.twitter.com/6omN5rGUUh— James Price (@_GamesPrice_) 24 October 2016

  31. Jay – Good point with regards to the ATT/-DEF bar as I have been experimenting along those lines and have been using Orange as a default and going up to red when I have possession, which leads to more variety of goals. If I go in the lead I switch back and forth between green and orange. For advise just look at how the top teams (Chelsea, Man United etc) change thier levels during the course of a match.

  32. James – filthy strikes with Walace. Kind of player that makes you want to play one more game! What’s his total like compared to your striker(s)?

  33. Jay – Seven last season, six from range. But he’s getting better. Think I might stop with the more blatant free kick efforts, though – the lack of marking feels like an exploit.

  34. Morning.
    Having a horrible time with PES 17 at the moment. So much so that I threw the controller down in disgust and turned it off last night.

    After my 5th placed finish in the prem on Top Player last year, I expected to challenge for the title this year, have strengthened the squad by bringing in a few higher rated players, but the game seems to have flicked a ‘Bullshit Mode’ switch, Im 2nd bottom after 12 games, won 2, drawn 2, lost 8, minus 16 GD. Im conceding 3 or 4 goals often, its a complete reversal of last year, something has absolutely definitely happened with the game and I don’t know what.

    Every single team, every game, plays with 100% constant frantic aggression and pressure, My players are seemingly unable to pass 5 yards without it being intercepted, COM players are all stronger and just push me off the ball, Im unable to dribble at all, due to the facts above, and the lack of fouls being given has been ramped up tenfold, if that was even possible.

    Right now playing PES is a chore, and as far removed from enjoyable as possible. It’s only been since the first game of this new season, last season the seasons before were all fun, and totally different. something is amiss.

  35. Paul – that is exactly the same feeling I had, that season three suddenly changed and that it wasn’t altering from one match to the next. The matches should have been getting more enjoyable and yet every team was the same overpowered hulk effort.

    New ml and after eight matches I’m on 5 points, one win, two draws. Very different approach from me with a very good keeper. However, same old issue – 1 goal scored. I’d be last on match of the day every week.

  36. Turf, its such a stark departure from how the game played before that its markedly noticeable.
    I played Middlesbrough last night, and the second I got the ball, bang,3 players on top of me, constant aggressive pressure, every time I attempt any kind of dribble, its pointless, I just get dispossessed, passes are always intercepted, even when playing a 5 yard pass sideways, and the COM just hacks me down freely as nothing is ever given.

    Maybe PES 17 isn’t the great game it first shaped up to be after all, I’m severely tempted to go buy FIFA.

  37. James – your Walace-with-one-L popped up in a Search last night… but I’d already done my transfer window shopping and didn’t have the cash anyway. Took a good long look at his stats and skills though. I find myself looking more at stats and skills this year than in any PES since the PS3 days.

    Paul/Uncle Turf – I’m just embarking on Season 3, Division 2, Professional, and finding the game still the same great experience as ever. If/when I get to the Promised Premier Land, and move up to TP/SS, I’ll see what I’ll see. Darryl, at a similar stage to yourself Paul, isn’t reporting the same suddenly overpowered AI and unenjoyable games, so could it be a TS thing?

  38. It could be a nuance of the game NG, but can’t see it being TS related as my TS is now 94, up from 93 last season when the game was enjoyable.
    There I some hidden underlying mechanic that has instructed every team to play identically against me, frantic, high pressure and aggressive.

    I will persevere, but at the moment if things carry on in the same vein, I’m a dead cert for relegation, and another 46 game season slog in the championship is not appealing.

  39. Paul – I remember Darryl calling his relegation with about 30 matches remaining too, and he escaped comfortably 🙂

  40. fingers crossed, I’m just disappointed that this shift in how the game plays has reared its head, its far more than just a run of bad form, the difference is massively noticeable.
    Last thing I want to be doing is restarting a ML with 4 seasons already played.

  41. Paul – I always think that digging in and scraping results and turning the tide is a hallmark of a classic ML. I read about your current turmoil and can’t wait to get there myself. ‘You wouldn’t say that if you had to put up with what the game’s doing’ etc. I bloody would! You can figure it out I’m sure. Get a 0-0. Then scrape a 1-0. The old ML way. In my own small way in D2 on Professional I’m also seeing strange times – check the final Season 2 table in today’s post – but I’m enjoying the challenge of unlocking the game.

  42. I hear ya NG, I am scraping the odd win, I beat Man Utd 2-1 on the back of 4 straight defeats, and scraped a 1-0 win against Middlesbrough, so the opportunities to win are there, just few and far between, my Europa league tilt has hit the skids, losing the last 2 matches means I need to beat Feyenoord, then secure a draw and hope they lose, or just bag 2 wins from my last 2 games to qualify.

    I’m just amazed at how the teams are playing against me compared to before with no seeming obvious changes in setup, TS , formation, or anything else.

    I’ve had Master League’s before in past PES’s where I won nothing, and played for 8 or more seasons, even if that happens this time around, I’d consider it a success, but one thing I cant overlook, is the enjoyment of playing the game, which I’m currently not experiencing often.

  43. Paul – could it just be the AI has figured you out? And is countering your style of play?

  44. Jay – possible but highly unlikely and unrealistic that every single team would play identically in every match, or that suddenly my passes are all intercepted, or that the opposition players have miraculously hulked up over pre-season and now all just shove my players off the ball.

  45. Paul – I’d be interested to see a recording of one of your games, see what the cpu is playing at.

  46. Tommy – I will record one later tonight and post here.

  47. Paul – the best course of action when the PES 2017 AI is at its most obnoxious in terms of pressing and fouls is to slow things right down.

    Stop dribbling. Don’t sprint.

    Instead, focus on your first touch. Every time one of your players receives the ball, you should be turning both in anticipation of an incoming opponent, body between him and the ball, and to set up your next pass.

    The PES 2017 AI is *very* good at intercepting or scything down runners when you adopt a fast, dynamic style of play, but isn’t so hot at dealing with possession for the sake of possession. A spell of keep-ball in the middle third gets you into a rhythm. You begin to anticipate how opponents are going to press, and start to notice movement that you might have missed before.

    Other than the obvious commentator calls on teams adopting strategy changes or man-marking individuals, we really don’t know much about the advertised adaptive difficulty feature. Is it a purely per-match thing, or is there some form of long-term analysis and adaptation? Just in case, I’ve made a habit of changing tempo during matches and varying my approach, even when I don’t need to, in order to stop the AI from “cracking” my tactics.

  48. Great comments James Thanks, I will try to be more patient and adopt the tactics you mentioned, i’m definitely guilty of trying to receive the ball and turn towards goal immediately, a lot of my possession turnovers come from being dispossessed in this way.

  49. Paul et al – that doesn’t sound good at all. If changes in playstyle don’t work – maybe take a job temporarily with another team / in another league perhaps even?

  50. Cracked tactics is a very dubious concept in Football Manager and even more so in PES IMO. If the programmers want to circumvent your tactics they will, no need to simulate an AI that learns.

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